Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)

[paul_adamson]

WARNING, THIS IS A LONG RANT.

I've had some good days out with the Club Lotus track day at Castle Coombe
race circuit.
In the past, I've driven the circuit in my +2S and my sisters S2 Europa.
I've been looking forward to the day when I would be able to do the same in
my Elan S4SE.
I send the application to Club Lotus - but must not have been quick enough
as I was placed on the reserve list at number c.17. I was told that as the
event had been so oversubscribed, the club was considering increasing the
number of cars on the track from 6 to 12 at a time.
Sure enough, that's what happened and I got my entrance details.
My wife and I took a 1/2 day off work (Friday) and drove to a nice B&B in
the vicinity of the track.
Next morning we arrive at the track and get registration over with just in
time to join the queue for the track.
This is were the problems start.
This year, unlike previous years there was no scrutineering as such, just
the formality of an exhaust noise check. Obviously, there's nothing to worry
about there - from previous experience, the only cars I've known to have
failed were rally prepared Lotus Sunbeams :-p
My car is a standard S4SE with the twin tailpipe silencer(s). The noise
limit was 100db, my Elan recorded 104.1db.
I was gutted.
I asked the noise check chap what to do and he suggested I pay a visit to
Merlin Motorsports - on site. They may be able to help. So, I join a queue.
The way it works is, you can try a short silencer that fits over the outlet
pipe. If your car passed the check this time, it's ?60. =8-|
Now, as I said, my car has 2 tail-pipes. That's ?120 (For a pair of
silencers I will only be using once, or once a year)
I tried just using one of these stubby little silencers and had the car
re-checked. This time, it recorded 107 db.

This was getting silly.
I know that the noise scale is logarithmic, or a 3db increase is in fact a
doubling of the sound energy.
This means that added the extra silencer increased the cars noise level by
100%

There comes a time to cut you losses, so I spend some time wandering around
the place like a lost soul.
I had a chat with a bloke that runs a 1700cc Elan with 170bhp and a red line
at 8400rpm. His car has an exhaust that could serve as a bazooka.
(You can see where this is going can't you).
His car was measured at 99db. He drives the car at circuits all over the
place. He told me his car is always measured at 97db.

Just then, there came an announcement over the tanoy. "Will those drivers
whose cars have failed the noise test - please come and leave their names
and addresses at the Club Lotus tent."
So, my dear wife set off to the tent and upon presenting herself, the lady
at the desk looked at her with the "what do you expect me to do" expression.

I decided to got for a walk to calm down before going to see Mr Graham
Arnold. (Man in charge at Club Lotus) Where I explained the days events
i.e.. 2 x 1/2 days leave from work, 2 nights booked at a B&B (?110) and the
5 hour drive down the country. I explained that the only option I could see
was buying a single tailpipe exhaust from a guy I spotted in the car park
for ?90 and then having to add the stubby silencer (another ?60).
This is turning out to be an expensive day at the track!

To his credit, he kept on smiling like a true politician.
Now this is where the sting comes, remember, I'd paid c.?55? for my track
time. A young couple approach and ask if they can drive their Elise on the
circuit bearing in mind that they are NOT Club Lotus members.
Mr Arnold stopped talking to me and said to them,
"We take cash, cheque, credit card, what ever you've got, we don't mind. You
just give us the ?45"

At this point, I decided to make my exit.

Now, I should point out in all fairness, that the documentation clearly
states that the only cars allowed on the track must meet the 100db noise
limit set by the local council.

How loud is your Elan? Where can the average Club Lotus member find out? You
see my point?
I have a well equipped garage. I have a type pressure gauge - but I do not
have access to a noise level meter.

One final point, when I was at Merlin Motorsport the guy said "It's a pity
the track day it 100db, they run days were the limit is 105db"

I'll leave you to draw you own conclusions.... "?"

The question is, How should I proceed? Should I politely ask for a refund
from Club Lotus?
Should this have been advertised as a track day for Lotus Elises?

["Brian"]

Gee Paul, that note is enough to come out of lurk mode for !

I'm surprised your car is so loud - does it sound so compared with others
when you're on a run, etc ? I know the replacement stainless exhausts are
often a bit louder but not that much, and if the car is standard then it
seems a bit immoral for CL to organise a day with limits that a standard car
(as supplied originally by Lotus) will knowingly fail.

It's a bit late now but I'd have asked to see calibration certs for the
meter or even if the guy conducting the tests was used to doing them.

If the late comer Elise was standard, then yep, it's quiet, but from my
experience most elise owners junk the standard exhaust and buy something
"sporty" asap. And all the aftermarket exhausts I've heard are definitely
loud - too loud for me - some folks even use earplugs on long runs.....
strange ideas.

Yes, I'd have a go at getting my cash back - maybe in collaboration with
some of the other "noisy owners". The trouble is that CL isn't really a
democracy (personal view) so it's going to be hard work to make a case.

best of luck
Brian

[jeff jackson]

I'm afraid if it were me, I'd had blown a fuse a long time before you. I
admire the fact that you kept as calm as you did.
It maybe worth writing to Club Lotus, bearing in mind the slogan which is
always printed on the front cover
" Free to comment,congratulate or critisise".
Any letter I have written never gets printed, if it is a criticism of the
club ( and I have many), or never gets a reply. You may notice that any
letter that praises the club to high heaven does. I have been a member of
Club Lotus for 22 years, and it has always been like it. ( along with the
quality of the magazine),
Now who's ranting!?
Jeff
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Adamson" <***@***.***>

Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 12:05 AM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)

[simonknee]

Paul,

How was the noise level measured. I assume with a hand help device.
Any idea of the make or model?
Where was it held, position, direction pointed and how far away?
Did you have to rev to a certain limit?

Does anybody on list know if there are official measurement techniques and
equipment?
If so what governing body specifies these or is it down to the local
council?

I'm a technical engineer in the recording industry so I know a thing or two
about measuring audio levels and the kit that goes with it. I may be able to
profer some help, if only so that you can be better armed next time you go
to a track day. Need to know a bit more about what goes on first!

Simon


-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Adamson [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: 27 May 2002 00:05
To: ***@***.***
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


WARNING, THIS IS A LONG RANT.

I've had some good days out with the Club Lotus track day at Castle Coombe
race circuit.
In the past, I've driven the circuit in my +2S and my sisters S2 Europa.
I've been looking forward to the day when I would be able to do the same in
my Elan S4SE.
I send the application to Club Lotus - but must not have been quick enough
as I was placed on the reserve list at number c.17. I was told that as the
event had been so oversubscribed, the club was considering increasing the
number of cars on the track from 6 to 12 at a time.
Sure enough, that's what happened and I got my entrance details.
My wife and I took a 1/2 day off work (Friday) and drove to a nice B&B in
the vicinity of the track.
Next morning we arrive at the track and get registration over with just in
time to join the queue for the track.
This is were the problems start.
This year, unlike previous years there was no scrutineering as such, just
the formality of an exhaust noise check. Obviously, there's nothing to worry
about there - from previous experience, the only cars I've known to have
failed were rally prepared Lotus Sunbeams :-p
My car is a standard S4SE with the twin tailpipe silencer(s). The noise
limit was 100db, my Elan recorded 104.1db.
I was gutted.
I asked the noise check chap what to do and he suggested I pay a visit to
Merlin Motorsports - on site. They may be able to help. So, I join a queue.
The way it works is, you can try a short silencer that fits over the outlet
pipe. If your car passed the check this time, it's ?60. =8-|
Now, as I said, my car has 2 tail-pipes. That's ?120 (For a pair of
silencers I will only be using once, or once a year)
I tried just using one of these stubby little silencers and had the car
re-checked. This time, it recorded 107 db.

This was getting silly.
I know that the noise scale is logarithmic, or a 3db increase is in fact a
doubling of the sound energy.
This means that added the extra silencer increased the cars noise level by
100%

There comes a time to cut you losses, so I spend some time wandering around
the place like a lost soul.
I had a chat with a bloke that runs a 1700cc Elan with 170bhp and a red line
at 8400rpm. His car has an exhaust that could serve as a bazooka.
(You can see where this is going can't you).
His car was measured at 99db. He drives the car at circuits all over the
place. He told me his car is always measured at 97db.

Just then, there came an announcement over the tanoy. "Will those drivers
whose cars have failed the noise test - please come and leave their names
and addresses at the Club Lotus tent."
So, my dear wife set off to the tent and upon presenting herself, the lady
at the desk looked at her with the "what do you expect me to do" expression.

I decided to got for a walk to calm down before going to see Mr Graham
Arnold. (Man in charge at Club Lotus) Where I explained the days events
i.e.. 2 x 1/2 days leave from work, 2 nights booked at a B&B (?110) and the
5 hour drive down the country. I explained that the only option I could see
was buying a single tailpipe exhaust from a guy I spotted in the car park
for ?90 and then having to add the stubby silencer (another ?60).
This is turning out to be an expensive day at the track!

To his credit, he kept on smiling like a true politician.
Now this is where the sting comes, remember, I'd paid c.?55? for my track
time. A young couple approach and ask if they can drive their Elise on the
circuit bearing in mind that they are NOT Club Lotus members.
Mr Arnold stopped talking to me and said to them,
"We take cash, cheque, credit card, what ever you've got, we don't mind. You
just give us the ?45"

At this point, I decided to make my exit.

Now, I should point out in all fairness, that the documentation clearly
states that the only cars allowed on the track must meet the 100db noise
limit set by the local council.

How loud is your Elan? Where can the average Club Lotus member find out? You
see my point?
I have a well equipped garage. I have a type pressure gauge - but I do not
have access to a noise level meter.

One final point, when I was at Merlin Motorsport the guy said "It's a pity
the track day it 100db, they run days were the limit is 105db"

I'll leave you to draw you own conclusions.... "?"

The question is, How should I proceed? Should I politely ask for a refund
from Club Lotus?
Should this have been advertised as a track day for Lotus Elises?

[Piers James]

If I am correct, the area where the machine is tested will make a difference
too.

Out in the open (no sound bounce off objects)?

In an enclosed garage area (sound bouncing off walls, people standing
nearby, etc.)?


In industry there are strict standards for measurements and calculations
required based on readings in a radius around the sound source. Results
obtained, after applying a complex formula, cannot be replicated with a
hand-held meter and single reading.

Piers


-----Original Message-----
From: Simon Knee [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 10:22 AM
To: '***@***.***'
Subject: RE: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


Paul,

How was the noise level measured. I assume with a hand help device.
Any idea of the make or model?
Where was it held, position, direction pointed and how far away?
Did you have to rev to a certain limit?

Does anybody on list know if there are official measurement techniques and
equipment?
If so what governing body specifies these or is it down to the local
council?

I'm a technical engineer in the recording industry so I know a thing or two
about measuring audio levels and the kit that goes with it. I may be able to
profer some help, if only so that you can be better armed next time you go
to a track day. Need to know a bit more about what goes on first!

Simon


-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Adamson [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: 27 May 2002 00:05
To: ***@***.***
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


WARNING, THIS IS A LONG RANT.

I've had some good days out with the Club Lotus track day at Castle Coombe
race circuit.
In the past, I've driven the circuit in my +2S and my sisters S2 Europa.
I've been looking forward to the day when I would be able to do the same in
my Elan S4SE.
I send the application to Club Lotus - but must not have been quick enough
as I was placed on the reserve list at number c.17. I was told that as the
event had been so oversubscribed, the club was considering increasing the
number of cars on the track from 6 to 12 at a time.
Sure enough, that's what happened and I got my entrance details.
My wife and I took a 1/2 day off work (Friday) and drove to a nice B&B in
the vicinity of the track.
Next morning we arrive at the track and get registration over with just in
time to join the queue for the track.
This is were the problems start.
This year, unlike previous years there was no scrutineering as such, just
the formality of an exhaust noise check. Obviously, there's nothing to worry
about there - from previous experience, the only cars I've known to have
failed were rally prepared Lotus Sunbeams :-p
My car is a standard S4SE with the twin tailpipe silencer(s). The noise
limit was 100db, my Elan recorded 104.1db.
I was gutted.
I asked the noise check chap what to do and he suggested I pay a visit to
Merlin Motorsports - on site. They may be able to help. So, I join a queue.
The way it works is, you can try a short silencer that fits over the outlet
pipe. If your car passed the check this time, it's ?60. =8-|
Now, as I said, my car has 2 tail-pipes. That's ?120 (For a pair of
silencers I will only be using once, or once a year)
I tried just using one of these stubby little silencers and had the car
re-checked. This time, it recorded 107 db.

This was getting silly.
I know that the noise scale is logarithmic, or a 3db increase is in fact a
doubling of the sound energy.
This means that added the extra silencer increased the cars noise level by
100%

There comes a time to cut you losses, so I spend some time wandering around
the place like a lost soul.
I had a chat with a bloke that runs a 1700cc Elan with 170bhp and a red line
at 8400rpm. His car has an exhaust that could serve as a bazooka.
(You can see where this is going can't you).
His car was measured at 99db. He drives the car at circuits all over the
place. He told me his car is always measured at 97db.

Just then, there came an announcement over the tanoy. "Will those drivers
whose cars have failed the noise test - please come and leave their names
and addresses at the Club Lotus tent."
So, my dear wife set off to the tent and upon presenting herself, the lady
at the desk looked at her with the "what do you expect me to do" expression.

I decided to got for a walk to calm down before going to see Mr Graham
Arnold. (Man in charge at Club Lotus) Where I explained the days events
i.e.. 2 x 1/2 days leave from work, 2 nights booked at a B&B (?110) and the
5 hour drive down the country. I explained that the only option I could see
was buying a single tailpipe exhaust from a guy I spotted in the car park
for ?90 and then having to add the stubby silencer (another ?60).
This is turning out to be an expensive day at the track!

To his credit, he kept on smiling like a true politician.
Now this is where the sting comes, remember, I'd paid c.?55? for my track
time. A young couple approach and ask if they can drive their Elise on the
circuit bearing in mind that they are NOT Club Lotus members.
Mr Arnold stopped talking to me and said to them,
"We take cash, cheque, credit card, what ever you've got, we don't mind. You
just give us the ?45"

At this point, I decided to make my exit.

Now, I should point out in all fairness, that the documentation clearly
states that the only cars allowed on the track must meet the 100db noise
limit set by the local council.

How loud is your Elan? Where can the average Club Lotus member find out? You
see my point?
I have a well equipped garage. I have a type pressure gauge - but I do not
have access to a noise level meter.

One final point, when I was at Merlin Motorsport the guy said "It's a pity
the track day it 100db, they run days were the limit is 105db"

I'll leave you to draw you own conclusions.... "?"

The question is, How should I proceed? Should I politely ask for a refund
from Club Lotus?
Should this have been advertised as a track day for Lotus Elises?

["alan greenhill"]

I didn't have my car checked but the instrument used was a long probe that went up inside the exhaust.
Hope this helps, sorry can't tell you any more
Al
----- Original Message -----
From: Simon Knee
To: '***@***.***'
Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 3:21 PM
Subject: RE: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


Paul,

How was the noise level measured. I assume with a hand help device.
Any idea of the make or model?
Where was it held, position, direction pointed and how far away?
Did you have to rev to a certain limit?

Does anybody on list know if there are official measurement techniques and
equipment?
If so what governing body specifies these or is it down to the local
council?

I'm a technical engineer in the recording industry so I know a thing or two
about measuring audio levels and the kit that goes with it. I may be ableto
profer some help, if only so that you can be better armed next time you go
to a track day. Need to know a bit more about what goes on first!

Simon


-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Adamson [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: 27 May 2002 00:05
To: ***@***.***
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


WARNING, THIS IS A LONG RANT.

I've had some good days out with the Club Lotus track day at Castle Coombe
race circuit.
In the past, I've driven the circuit in my +2S and my sisters S2 Europa.
I've been looking forward to the day when I would be able to do the same in
my Elan S4SE.
I send the application to Club Lotus - but must not have been quick enough
as I was placed on the reserve list at number c.17. I was told that as the
event had been so oversubscribed, the club was considering increasing the
number of cars on the track from 6 to 12 at a time.
Sure enough, that's what happened and I got my entrance details.
My wife and I took a 1/2 day off work (Friday) and drove to a nice B&B in
the vicinity of the track.
Next morning we arrive at the track and get registration over with just in
time to join the queue for the track.
This is were the problems start.
This year, unlike previous years there was no scrutineering as such, just
the formality of an exhaust noise check. Obviously, there's nothing to worry
about there - from previous experience, the only cars I've known to have
failed were rally prepared Lotus Sunbeams :-p
My car is a standard S4SE with the twin tailpipe silencer(s). The noise
limit was 100db, my Elan recorded 104.1db.
I was gutted.
I asked the noise check chap what to do and he suggested I pay a visit to
Merlin Motorsports - on site. They may be able to help. So, I join a queue.
The way it works is, you can try a short silencer that fits over the outlet
pipe. If your car passed the check this time, it's ?60. =8-|
Now, as I said, my car has 2 tail-pipes. That's ?120 (For a pair of
silencers I will only be using once, or once a year)
I tried just using one of these stubby little silencers and had the car
re-checked. This time, it recorded 107 db.

This was getting silly.
I know that the noise scale is logarithmic, or a 3db increase is in fact a
doubling of the sound energy.
This means that added the extra silencer increased the cars noise level by
100%

There comes a time to cut you losses, so I spend some time wandering around
the place like a lost soul.
I had a chat with a bloke that runs a 1700cc Elan with 170bhp and a red line
at 8400rpm. His car has an exhaust that could serve as a bazooka.
(You can see where this is going can't you).
His car was measured at 99db. He drives the car at circuits all over the
place. He told me his car is always measured at 97db.

Just then, there came an announcement over the tanoy. "Will those drivers
whose cars have failed the noise test - please come and leave their names
and addresses at the Club Lotus tent."
So, my dear wife set off to the tent and upon presenting herself, the lady
at the desk looked at her with the "what do you expect me to do" expression.

I decided to got for a walk to calm down before going to see Mr Graham
Arnold. (Man in charge at Club Lotus) Where I explained the days events
i.e.. 2 x 1/2 days leave from work, 2 nights booked at a B&B (?110) andthe
5 hour drive down the country. I explained that the only option I could see
was buying a single tailpipe exhaust from a guy I spotted in the car park
for ?90 and then having to add the stubby silencer (another ?60).
This is turning out to be an expensive day at the track!

To his credit, he kept on smiling like a true politician.
Now this is where the sting comes, remember, I'd paid c.?55? for my track
time. A young couple approach and ask if they can drive their Elise on the
circuit bearing in mind that they are NOT Club Lotus members.
Mr Arnold stopped talking to me and said to them,
"We take cash, cheque, credit card, what ever you've got, we don't mind. You
just give us the ?45"

At this point, I decided to make my exit.

Now, I should point out in all fairness, that the documentation clearly
states that the only cars allowed on the track must meet the 100db noise
limit set by the local council.

How loud is your Elan? Where can the average Club Lotus member find out? You
see my point?
I have a well equipped garage. I have a type pressure gauge - but I do not
have access to a noise level meter.

One final point, when I was at Merlin Motorsport the guy said "It's a pity
the track day it 100db, they run days were the limit is 105db"

I'll leave you to draw you own conclusions.... "?"

The question is, How should I proceed? Should I politely ask for a refund
from Club Lotus?
Should this have been advertised as a track day for Lotus Elises?

[elansprint71]

Club Lotus is one of 3 clubs that I am aware of.(there may be more) run as a
means of making a living by Graham Arnold, from the same address: (Lotus,
Vauxhall & BMW). His BMW Driver's Club runs a magazine with the exact same
format as the Club Lotus magazine and is vitrioliic in it's hatred of the
other much bigger, factory supported BMW Car Club, which until recently I
was a member of. I find that some of the sarcastic comments in both
magazines to be ill informed, mendacious and downright unpleasant.
Paul, it does not surprise me that you were treated in this fashion, I am
seriously considering cancelling my membership to this Lotus club, as I did
to his BMW club some years ago. I have already dispensed with the Club Lotus
Insurance scheme, because I found more extensive cover at a fraction of the
price they wanted me to pay. However, Graham Arnold seems to be the only
source of an agreed valuation for old Loti, to get the valuation you first
have to join the club(!) and then pay a valuation fee(!!!).

I think that I know why the Donnington show was shunned by so many
specialists this year.

I have taken a six month trial membership of the Lotus Drivers Club to see
how that goes.

Then of course there is CLOG !!!

Cheers,

Pete

-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Adamson [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: 27 May 2002 00:05
To: ***@***.***
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


WARNING, THIS IS A LONG RANT.

I've had some good days out with the Club Lotus track day at Castle Coombe
race circuit.
In the past, I've driven the circuit in my +2S and my sisters S2 Europa.
I've been looking forward to the day when I would be able to do the same in
my Elan S4SE.
I send the application to Club Lotus - but must not have been quick enough
as I was placed on the reserve list at number c.17. I was told that as the
event had been so oversubscribed, the club was considering increasing the
number of cars on the track from 6 to 12 at a time.
Sure enough, that's what happened and I got my entrance details.
My wife and I took a 1/2 day off work (Friday) and drove to a nice B&B in
the vicinity of the track.
Next morning we arrive at the track and get registration over with just in
time to join the queue for the track.
This is were the problems start.
This year, unlike previous years there was no scrutineering as such, just
the formality of an exhaust noise check. Obviously, there's nothing to worry
about there - from previous experience, the only cars I've known to have
failed were rally prepared Lotus Sunbeams :-p
My car is a standard S4SE with the twin tailpipe silencer(s). The noise
limit was 100db, my Elan recorded 104.1db.
I was gutted.
I asked the noise check chap what to do and he suggested I pay a visit to
Merlin Motorsports - on site. They may be able to help. So, I join a queue.
The way it works is, you can try a short silencer that fits over the outlet
pipe. If your car passed the check this time, it's ?60. =8-|
Now, as I said, my car has 2 tail-pipes. That's ?120 (For a pair of
silencers I will only be using once, or once a year)
I tried just using one of these stubby little silencers and had the car
re-checked. This time, it recorded 107 db.

This was getting silly.
I know that the noise scale is logarithmic, or a 3db increase is in fact a
doubling of the sound energy.
This means that added the extra silencer increased the cars noise level by
100%

There comes a time to cut you losses, so I spend some time wandering around
the place like a lost soul.
I had a chat with a bloke that runs a 1700cc Elan with 170bhp and a red line
at 8400rpm. His car has an exhaust that could serve as a bazooka.
(You can see where this is going can't you).
His car was measured at 99db. He drives the car at circuits all over the
place. He told me his car is always measured at 97db.

Just then, there came an announcement over the tanoy. "Will those drivers
whose cars have failed the noise test - please come and leave their names
and addresses at the Club Lotus tent."
So, my dear wife set off to the tent and upon presenting herself, the lady
at the desk looked at her with the "what do you expect me to do" expression.

I decided to got for a walk to calm down before going to see Mr Graham
Arnold. (Man in charge at Club Lotus) Where I explained the days events
i.e.. 2 x 1/2 days leave from work, 2 nights booked at a B&B (?110) and the
5 hour drive down the country. I explained that the only option I could see
was buying a single tailpipe exhaust from a guy I spotted in the car park
for ?90 and then having to add the stubby silencer (another ?60).
This is turning out to be an expensive day at the track!

To his credit, he kept on smiling like a true politician.
Now this is where the sting comes, remember, I'd paid c.?55? for my track
time. A young couple approach and ask if they can drive their Elise on the
circuit bearing in mind that they are NOT Club Lotus members.
Mr Arnold stopped talking to me and said to them,
"We take cash, cheque, credit card, what ever you've got, we don't mind. You
just give us the ?45"

At this point, I decided to make my exit.

Now, I should point out in all fairness, that the documentation clearly
states that the only cars allowed on the track must meet the 100db noise
limit set by the local council.

How loud is your Elan? Where can the average Club Lotus member find out? You
see my point?
I have a well equipped garage. I have a type pressure gauge - but I do not
have access to a noise level meter.

One final point, when I was at Merlin Motorsport the guy said "It's a pity
the track day it 100db, they run days were the limit is 105db"

I'll leave you to draw you own conclusions.... "?"

The question is, How should I proceed? Should I politely ask for a refund
from Club Lotus?
Should this have been advertised as a track day for Lotus Elises?

[Fred Talmadge]

In the pump industry we measure the background level without the pump
running and then compare it with the pump running. Actually the motor
makes all the noise, especially the fan. I'm sure every industry is
different. It's all done with a calibrated hand held device. Not very
accurate but as mentioned by others, once the equipment is installed, the
sound will be completely different.

Dang it you guys, now you got me thinking of work on this Memorial holiday
(USA)

Fred T


At 10:39 AM 5/27/2002 -0400, you wrote:

[elansprint71]

At work we had a 2.5 million pound (money!) mail sorting system fail it's
noise test, glum faces all around until I suggested they took a reading with
the machine switched off- guess what, the building failed too, mainly
because of the background noise from the radio!

Happy holiday in Tx Fred.

Pete

-----Original Message-----
From: Fred Talmadge [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: 27 May 2002 16:29
To: ***@***.***
Subject: RE: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


In the pump industry we measure the background level without the pump
running and then compare it with the pump running. Actually the motor
makes all the noise, especially the fan. I'm sure every industry is
different. It's all done with a calibrated hand held device. Not very
accurate but as mentioned by others, once the equipment is installed, the
sound will be completely different.

Dang it you guys, now you got me thinking of work on this Memorial holiday
(USA)

Fred T


At 10:39 AM 5/27/2002 -0400, you wrote:







the Disclaimer! Copyright) 1999, 2000, 2001 LotusElan.net and the email

[ardee_selby]

--- In lotuselan@y..., Simon Knee <simon@a...> wrote:

Check out this site.
<http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/shpub/noise.html>

It would seem the test carried wasn't the normal RAC method.

Cheers - Richard

[M100]

On Mon, 27 May 2002 19:38:46 +0100, "alan greenhill"
<***@***.***> wrote:


UP the exhaust?, that might explain it then

Standard methods are defined in the MSA Blue Book, i've not got a copy
of the current one but I could scan in and post the details in the
2001 edition. The distances from the exhaust to the measuring
instrument if I recall were defined as 0.8m, 3m and 8m.


--

[simonknee]

Where you at the same track day as Paul?
Probe up the exhaust????
You sure that wasn't emissions????
This is a completely cobblers method of noise measurement, can't even begin
to say how wrong it is!
Get yer money back!

Simon


-----Original Message-----
From: alan greenhill [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: 27 May 2002 19:39
To: ***@***.***
Subject: Re: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


I didn't have my car checked but the instrument used was a long probe that
went up inside the exhaust.
Hope this helps, sorry can't tell you any more
Al
----- Original Message -----
From: Simon Knee
To: '***@***.***'
Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 3:21 PM
Subject: RE: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)

[paul_adamson]

I seem to have generated some confusion - so I'll attempt to clarify the
events of Saturday last.
<Takes a deep breath>

The track day at Castle Coombe was organised by Club Lotus.
(That's a Club that caters for all Lotus road cars from the Type 14 to the
latest model Elise and V8's)

AFTER I booked the day I was informed in the blurb that the noise limit was
100db.
As my Elan is standard (except for braided brake lines, and aluminium
steering rack mounts), I didn't even consider that it would fail a noise
test.
The exhaust system is a stainless steel twin box and twin tailpipes item
from Paul Matty. (Apart from being SS that's how it should be).

The sound level meter had what looked to be two elements. I guess that the
longer one that was put right up against the tailpipes is used to get the
50cm distance for the other short probe?

The three things that REALLY get me are:
1) How is the average Club Lotus owner supposed to know the db level of
their car? (Except by paying ?55 for a track day!)
2) While I was talking to Graham Arnold, he negotiated ?45 for a track
day from a non Club Lotus member! That's ?10 less than I paid!
3) The track was booked as a 100db day when it could have been booked at
105db.
(Once again, I'm guessing that reasons for a 100db day come down to
hard cash)

Just to show that I haven't dreamt the 105db track days see the link below
from a Ferrari website.

http://www.gtr.co.uk/Coombe.html
"They are very strict about noise here because of the residents. As well as
scruitineering they also check every car with a meter before it's allowed
out on the track. Cars with exhaust systems louder than 105db will not be
allowed on!"

So, should I ask for my money back?

Paul (noisy) Adamson.

[jeff jackson]

YES! Get your money back or tell GA where to stick his club.
I get more info off the net and from this list than I ever do from CL.
(Except anecdotes from 1964 about Colin Chapman.)
P.S. I still have not had a refund on a CL tie that was out of stock, and
THAT was about five years ago! Given up trying.
Jeff.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Adamson" <***@***.***>

Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2002 9:39 PM
Subject: RE: [LotusElan.net] Castle Coombe Track day debacle. (long)


I seem to have generated some confusion - so I'll attempt to clarify the
events of Saturday last.
<Takes a deep breath>

The track day at Castle Coombe was organised by Club Lotus.
(That's a Club that caters for all Lotus road cars from the Type 14 to the
latest model Elise and V8's)

AFTER I booked the day I was informed in the blurb that the noise limit was
100db.
As my Elan is standard (except for braided brake lines, and aluminium
steering rack mounts), I didn't even consider that it would fail a noise
test.
The exhaust system is a stainless steel twin box and twin tailpipes item
from Paul Matty. (Apart from being SS that's how it should be).

The sound level meter had what looked to be two elements. I guess that the
longer one that was put right up against the tailpipes is used to get the
50cm distance for the other short probe?

The three things that REALLY get me are:
1) How is the average Club Lotus owner supposed to know the db level of
their car? (Except by paying ?55 for a track day!)
2) While I was talking to Graham Arnold, he negotiated ?45 for a track
day from a non Club Lotus member! That's ?10 less than I paid!
3) The track was booked as a 100db day when it could have been booked at
105db.
(Once again, I'm guessing that reasons for a 100db day come down to
hard cash)

Just to show that I haven't dreamt the 105db track days see the link below
from a Ferrari website.

http://www.gtr.co.uk/Coombe.html
"They are very strict about noise here because of the residents. As well as
scruitineering they also check every car with a meter before it's allowed
out on the track. Cars with exhaust systems louder than 105db will not be
allowed on!"

So, should I ask for my money back?

Paul (noisy) Adamson.

[Elan45]

No, you should not ask for your money back, YOU SHOULD DEMAND IT BE RETURNED IMMEDIATELY!

Roger



events of Saturday last.
<Takes a deep breath>

The track day at Castle Coombe was organised by Club Lotus.
(That's a Club that caters for all Lotus road cars from the Type 14 to the
latest model Elise and V8's)

AFTER I booked the day I was informed in the blurb that the noise limit was
100db.
As my Elan is standard (except for braided brake lines, and aluminium
steering rack mounts), I didn't even consider that it would fail a noise
test.
The exhaust system is a stainless steel twin box and twin tailpipes item
from Paul Matty. (Apart from being SS that's how it should be).

The sound level meter had what looked to be two elements. I guess that the
longer one that was put right up against the tailpipes is used to get the
50cm distance for the other short probe?

The three things that REALLY get me are:
1) How is the average Club Lotus owner supposed to know the db level of
their car? (Except by paying ?55 for a track day!)
2) While I was talking to Graham Arnold, he negotiated ?45 for a track
day from a non Club Lotus member! That's ?10 less than I paid!
3) The track was booked as a 100db day when it could have been booked at
105db.
(Once again, I'm guessing that reasons for a 100db day come down to
hard cash)

Just to show that I haven't dreamt the 105db track days see the link below
from a Ferrari website.

http://www.gtr.co.uk/Coombe.html
"They are very strict about noise here because of the residents. As well as
scruitineering they also check every car with a meter before it's allowed
out on the track. Cars with exhaust systems louder than 105db will not be
allowed on!"

So, should I ask for my money back?

Paul (noisy) Adamson.