S4 dash refinishing

PostPost by: gjz30075 » Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:16 pm

Anyone out there ever refinished their S4 dash? I'm running into a problem with the words showing their edges, so to speak. The pic tells all. Most of the words are showing up this way, a few are not and look really good.

What I have done so far is stain, put the words down, then applied polyurethane, semi gloss, very lightly sanded (avoiding the words), put a second coat on, lightly sanded (avoiding the words), then put a third coat one and this is how the words are showing up. I plan to put on many more coats but if this condition is not going to get better, I need a plan. This is really disappointing. Any ideas?
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PostPost by: GrUmPyBoDgEr » Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:31 pm

Oh dear, I don't think any further coats of Varnish will help.
You seem to have used the fairly widely available "stick on" lettering which I think will always produce this result.
About 2 years ago one of the Forum members in Ireland had a batch of "Lettraset" type lettering made.
You rub these on to the Dashboard & only the Words are left no Label.
Give the Archives a search, there may be some left.
Good luck.
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PostPost by: csjohnson » Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:45 pm

I have not done this exact restore but this looks like something die cut vinyl would work the best. This goes on like a sticker but there is no backing. This is how we do lettering on the race cars. It might be too small of lettering but it might be worth looking into. I will talk with the shop that cuts our lettering and find out how small they can go.

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PostPost by: gjz30075 » Sat Dec 19, 2009 4:09 pm

John, I did contact that member in Ireland but he has no sets left. My other thought would be to put the words on after several coats of varnish, then varnish over them. I'll practice on some left over veneer I have, but I fear the results will be the same.

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PostPost by: andyhodg » Sat Dec 19, 2009 4:12 pm

Hi There

I have set of lettering that John is referring to. I ended up not using them as I fitted a replacement dash which came with the lettering. I would be happy to sell at the price I paid if you are interested.

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PostPost by: GrUmPyBoDgEr » Sat Dec 19, 2009 4:46 pm

andyhodg wrote:Hi There

I have set of lettering that John is referring to. I ended up not using them as I fitted a replacement dash which came with the lettering. I would be happy to sell at the price I paid if you are interested.

Regards

Andy


What a result!
It's responses like that, that remind me of what a great Community this Forum is. :D
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PostPost by: gjz30075 » Sat Dec 19, 2009 5:43 pm

Andy, sent a pm. Thanks!

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PostPost by: alexblack13 » Sat Dec 19, 2009 8:43 pm

Hi Guys,
I found, as suggested above, that the die cut vinyl worked great. I took the refurbed dash to a local good quality sign maker and had them do the full job. I had pics of the dash and the sizes of the lettering, so they had no bother at all. After they finished it (?25.00 +vat) I had another 6 coats of clear put on with a denib between coats. It has turned out quite good and does not look like a brand new (as I wanted) dash panel. It has managed to retain some of the car's original patina.

Always an option for you.

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PostPost by: archigator » Sat Dec 19, 2009 9:03 pm

Before I refinished my dash, I bought the book "Brightwork, the Art of Finishing Wood," by Rebecca Whittman. This excellent book is all about finishing wood hulls and trim on boats. Per the recommendations in this book, I used varnish in lieu of urethane. I can't remember why the author recommended varnish. (I can't find the book now.)

I bought the stick-on letters in a sheet from r.d. enterprises (not Letraset letters), cut the appropriate words out with an Exacto knife and stuck them on the unfinished dash wood panel. I then proceded to paint the dash with "Schooner" High Gloss Varnish with UV Protection # 96 (made by Interlux), one coat per day. (The "Brightwork" book says that this is the best varnish you can get, on par with Epifanes High-Gloss Clear Varnish.) Upon finishing the varnishing each 24 hour period, I would lightly sand-finish the varnish, clean with a tack cloth and re-varnish again... 7 coats in all. I would cover it with a cardboard cover that I'd fashioned, so it wouldn't get any dust on it while drying overnight. I would even strain the varnish from the can thru a filter into a cup before painting. I painted with a disposable foam brush. (All of this material can be purchased from a marine supply store.)


The resulting dash has been in my car for about 5 years, and it has never cracked or compromised in any way. The lettering appears a little yellowish, owing to the varnish I suppose, but the edge border of the lettering is not visible. I always get compliments on its appearance.

Gary
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PostPost by: gjz30075 » Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:12 pm

Gary's result looks pretty darn nice. Almost makes me wonder if I have the wrong finish. Alex and Chris, are the die cut vinyl ones individual letters that would peel off a backing of sorts, then put on something else (like the dash)? If so, I know my hands are too shakey to deal with that and it'll look like a pre-school project when I'm done.

Not quite sure how to fix this now.

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PostPost by: alexblack13 » Sat Dec 19, 2009 11:22 pm

Gary's method would be good for you. I too have to much 'shake' to put the lettering on so as I said I gave it to the pro's to do. I believe they do apply the lettering to a peel away 1st.

When I went to collect, it was great job. Back to the furniture maker who did the veneer work and the 1st two coats of laquer. He then laid another 6 coats on top of the lettering.

Gary's job would be very similar. Bang on.. I did NOT want a new looking dash. Keeping some patina was important. Looks like Gary managed this too.

Brill.

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PostPost by: GrUmPyBoDgEr » Sun Dec 20, 2009 12:37 am

Why get confused Greg?

The lettering that Andy has offered you are complete Words e.g. LIGHTS made up from separate Letters which you rub onto the dash in one go, perfectly aligned.
They also have practically no thickness so won't need copious coats of varnish to disguise them.
I expect that this approach is the same as or as close as you can get to the original Factory job.
I expect that the best way to actually use them would be to apply them prior to the last or last but one coat of varnish just to protect them from abrasion & to prevent them becoming Yellowish due to the many coats of varnish needed to attain the expected glossy finish.
The set that I have will go on to a finished Dashboard on top of the finish with a small prayer that they won't get damaged too quickly & I think that's more than likely the way it was done originally.

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PostPost by: alexblack13 » Sun Dec 20, 2009 12:26 pm

Hi All,
Hey John, The lettering will not last long unless coated over & they were finished this way from new. As far as I am aware the semi finished product was run thro a 'curtain coater' or a UV laquer line, which ran a heavy coat then conveyored it to a UV drier, then de-nibber then same again till thickness required was reached. Some of this equipment can do this in one pass along the system (We used to sell the equipment!).

Curtain coater systems produce a film, like cling film, (or what you get when you 'dip' your bubbles wand in the soap!) except its a liquid coating. Thro' this is passed the product which receives a thick coat without brushes /rollers or sprays. Most of the systems ren belts to and through UV driers, a slow pass through which dries the film. Quite a fast system..

However..I digress. It really is not a problem to get the protection coating onto the panel. A few passes with a spraygun or whatever method you choose will do a grand job.

Just follow Greg's system for coating it. If you can't find the lettering take it to a sign company. Have them apply the lettering for you.

Easy.. As John said... :wink:

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PostPost by: GrUmPyBoDgEr » Sun Dec 20, 2009 12:43 pm

Alex,

when I did my rebuild I put in a gorgeous Burr Walnut Dash that wasn't lettered.
I bought the a set from the UK that turned out to be the "stick on variety" but there was no way they were going on to my Car's Dash.
The Lettraset ones that I now have will go on to the Dash after a thorough degreasing when the Weather warms up.
However a glutton for punishment I'm not, there's no way that the Dash is coming out just to apply the Lettering & re-varnish.
Apart from that I always c-ck up Varnishing :roll:
Treated carefully the unprotected Letters will probably outlast me anyway :lol:

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PostPost by: alexblack13 » Sun Dec 20, 2009 7:11 pm

I'v a new lease of life John.. :wink: So I thought I would varnish the buggers in.. :lol: :lol: :lol: Got a lot of making up time to do next year. I lost 6 months of this year!! :?

Going to Goodwood & LeMans for the classic 24hr. 2 Week hol's .. In the Elan! How's that for bravery? .... OH Yes!!

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