Burton Power 45D4 Distributor- Anyone used one?

PostPost by: stugilmour » Thu Oct 25, 2018 7:34 pm

Has anyone used the Lucas 45D4 style non-vacuum advance distributor from Burton Power? I am wondering what advance curve the unit comes with?

I found a reference in the archive posts referencing a similar unit from Halfords, and the purchaser was able to specify the desired curve for about 35 quid. Not sure how it may work with Burton Power.

DESCRIPTION
Based on a new reproduction Lucas 45D4 style unit, this is a non-vacuum distributor which suits most engines from standard to virtually full race. Supplied with a side-entry cap, points, condensor and rotor arm. Approx static ignition timing: 12deg.BTDC. Surcharge refundable on return of any X/Flow distributor. For ignitor kit, use IGNLU143.

Current part number is FL303B. This apparently replaces part number FL300B.

http://www.burtonpower.com/modified-non ... l303b.html

Thanks

Stu
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b4e5de75-6001-4e85-b6fc-4b37b5589b5d.jpeg and
Burton Power Lucas Style 45D4. Appears to have correct angled cap, gear drive, clamp, points & condenser. Not sure what advance curve they comes with?
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PostPost by: Mazzini » Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:55 pm

You could always get your old distributor rebuilt by Distributor Doctor or if you're feeling flush there are 123 Ignition distributors.
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PostPost by: 69S4 » Fri Oct 26, 2018 8:06 am

I thought the 45's had screw fastened caps and the original 23's had the clip on ones? Whatever I've got on mine is screw fastened but I bought it from PM's so long ago I've forgotten exactly what type it is.

I'm not sure how you could diy test the advance curve other than reving the engine with a strobe light, noting the results and drawing the curve but you can check the maximum advance as it's stamped on the bob weights. Mine came with 7 degree weights (= 14 engine degrees) which had to be modified for my Stromberg engine.
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PostPost by: richardcox_lotus » Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:12 am

My 45 has a clip on cap, although I thought they should be screw on.

Another vagary.

+1 for Distributer Doctor, by the way.

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PostPost by: stugilmour » Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:29 pm

Thanks for the recommendation of Distributor Doctor.

I did not look closely enough under their new distributor tab. As I am in Canada (with additional shipping issues) and my original distributor is a Federal vacuum retard affair I would prefer to buy a new unit and just pay the core charges rather than have mine rebuilt.

Here is what Distributor Doctor has under New Distributor. I expect I just need to select a curve and check price/availability. I think the Big Valve 41189 curve is the most commonly used now with modern fuel, typical fast road mods, etc? My engine is a cammed Tall Block with Weber 45?s and Big Bore Exhaust with roughly 1950 cc. Any suggestions welcome; will also look through the archives as I recall Rohan had some pretty solid ideas.

http://www.distributordoctor.com/new-lu ... utors.html

New 23D4 Competition Distributors now available, for A Series 40819, 40979, MGA Twin Cam 40718, Ford Lotus Twin Cam 40953, 41189, Hillman, Holbay & many others.

Unlike all other versions available, these are machined in the UK, & built up with all original UK Lucas internals, including a full length bronze bush for linearity & longevity. All the other versions we've seen have random curves, loose bearings before they've even been run & intolerable dwell variation & timing scatter.

We can accurately calibrate them to any specification required & supply them with a graph. We use our 32oz points, yellow condensers, red rotors & new baseplates.

We can make 4 or 6 cylinders in Clockwise or Anticlockwise rotation, offset D drive or Ford/Lotus helical gear. We can stamp & date them to any specification required.


Thanks again. Will confirm they are clip-on cap; imagine the carbs have to come off if it is a screw-on type?

Stu
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c3e05c72-b48e-4abf-b135-f2ac4dd85be3.jpeg
23D4 Distributor from Distributor Doctor
c3e05c72-b48e-4abf-b135-f2ac4dd85be3.jpeg (46.68 KiB) Viewed 1938 times
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PostPost by: Mazzini » Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:44 pm

I have 123 Ignition distributors running in a S3 with a Nick Stagg Q420 head and a free flow exhaust system, I also have a perfectly standard Sprint, both engines have 10 degrees at idle and are fully advanced at 3,000 at 30 degrees. Both engines, though different seem to work well with similar, if not identical, advance curves.
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PostPost by: Mazzini » Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:16 pm

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Lotus-Twin-C ... rk:54:pf:0

Buy that and have it sent to Distributor Doctor.
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PostPost by: StressCraxx » Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:24 pm

Looking over D-Doctor's website, I like his notes on condensers.

My Crossle Formula Ford uses a Bosch distributor with points and condenser. I went through 3 condensers in two race weekends and wasted a $300 test day trying to troubleshoot and solve the issue. The condensers were OEM Bosch, but the boxes said "Made in Turkey". Jay Ivey (Ivey Engines, Portland OR) helped me solve the problem. He said OEM packaged condensers frequently failed during dyno runs.

I found one old "Made in Germany" condenser in my used spares junk box. The insulation was worn off in spots, so I cleaned it up, put on some heat shrink and installed it. Fired right up and ran perfect for the rest of the weekend and the following event as well.

Pertronix made in China are no better. Most guys here have given up on them. Jay had his own hall effect units made up that he installs in refurbished Lucas 23D4 and 45D4 dizzys.

Buyer beware.
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PostPost by: stugilmour » Sat Oct 27, 2018 12:05 am

StressCraxx wrote:.

....Pertronix made in China are no better. Most guys here have given up on them. Jay had his own hall effect units made up that he installs in refurbished Lucas 23D4 and 45D4 dizzys.

Buyer beware.


Well said. Reason I am trying to source a new dizzy is my brand new Pertronix is not working. I have gone through two modules trying to get the car started. Disappointing as the similar unit on my old engine worked great for years.

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PostPost by: stugilmour » Sat Oct 27, 2018 12:24 am

Mazzini wrote:I have 123 Ignition distributors running in a S3 with a Nick Stagg Q420 head and a free flow exhaust system, I also have a perfectly standard Sprint, both engines have 10 degrees at idle and are fully advanced at 3,000 at 30 degrees. Both engines, though different seem to work well with similar, if not identical, advance curves.


Thanks for that Mazzini.

Does the current iteration of 123 allow one to easily customize the curve and dial it in with road testing? I did see that they allow fiddling with the thing using a Smartphone, but was not sure if that only allows selecting from the dozen or so generic pre-loaded curves, or if one can load a half dozen or so custom curves that are close to what you want and then dial things in by selecting them individually? As you mention, maybe there is no real gain in doing a custom tuning exercise as the engine may run so well one can?t see a meaningful difference between the curves?

Cheers!

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PostPost by: mbell » Sat Oct 27, 2018 12:30 am

I think you can program it in the fly via Bluetooth and phone app.
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PostPost by: Mazzini » Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:31 am

Absolutely and you can isolate the distributor as an anti theft device, all done from a smart phone.
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PostPost by: stugilmour » Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:31 pm

Thanks for all the replies. A bit of an update.

At the recommendation of my engine builder I am going with a new MSD electronic Ignition. This will include a new distributor, cap, wires, etc. A disadvantage of this system is it uses a remote box that is quite large at roughly 8? x 4? x 2?. Current plan is to mount the 6AL Ignition controller near the glove box in the car interior as I don?t think it will easily fit in the engine bay below the airbox. MSD is recommended because of good spares availability in North America, very good quality control & reliability, and very accurate timing particularly at high rpm.

I took the advice here and tried to purchase a used stock distributor on eBay UK but was not successful. Most of the units that come up on eBay UK will not ship to NA, although one seller I contacted was OK with drop shipping the unit to Distributor Doctor for me.

Not sure what Martin at Distributor Doctor charges to rebuild a used one. He mentioned his new units are 325 GBP as a straight sale with no core.

I managed to get my old Federal vacuum retard distributor screwed together with a new set of points. Going to attempt to start the car using it, mainly to eliminate any potential electrical or fuel issues that may be preventing the engine from running in my car. The engine builder had test run my engine prior to removing the carbs and his bench Ignition system for shipping, so it is quite possible I have an installation issue preventing my new Pertronix from working. Figure if I can basically run the engine on my Federal distributor it will be good enough as a spare for the boot or whatever.

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