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Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Sat Jan 24, 2015 5:48 pm
by markcs
Hi Mike,

You have had exactly the same thought as me. I am currently restoring a 1973 +2, but when I have finished in a few years I am going to build up an electric +2. I have the candidate car in a spare garage which I bought with no engine.

A few months ago I drew up a rough budget, soon adds up, but with a fairly comprehensive package and batteries (AC motor/controller with regenerative braking) I reckon it is going to cost £12k or so. Rough calcs suggest a range of around 100 miles in the winter with lights and electric ceramic heater on, together with an electric vacuum pump for the brake servo.

Will be interested to see how you get on.

Mark

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 6:42 pm
by mcarling
I just bought an S3 Elan FHC that I will be converting to electric drive.

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 2:29 am
by mct340
I've "pulled the plug" on this for now. I agree with you on your cost estimate. That would be ok if I could be sure about battery life. Rumour has it if you lean on the gas pedal your range goes way down. Thoughts?

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 3:03 am
by mcarling
mct340 wrote:Rumour has it if you lean on the gas pedal your range goes way down. Thoughts?

My preliminary analysis suggests that consumption should be between 180 and 200 watt hours per mile at a steady speed of 60mph. How much range do you want?

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 10:44 am
by jimj
"air pollution of cars seen as being the biggest threat to the environment"!? I don`t think so. Don`t motor vehicles contribute 2% of the world`s pollution? Some famous (forgotten who) philosopher predicted in around 100AD that the world population could double in the following century and the world`s resources wouldn`t sustain such a number. It`s now 100 times greater and that`s what is causing pollution to gain ground over natural degradation.
Cars are just a soft target, we need euthanasia for everyone 1 year older than me and that will solve the problem and avoid the pension time-bomb associated with human longevity.
The electric Elan would be fascinating but why spoil a valuable car? Wouldn`t it be easier, cheaper and just better to use some kit car as a base. The constraints of the backbone chassis, in particular, seem an unnecessary difficulty.
Jim

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 12:40 pm
by billwill
jimj wrote:"air pollution of cars seen as being the biggest threat to the environment"!? I don`t think so. Don`t motor vehicles contribute 2% of the world`s pollution? Some famous (forgotten who) philosopher predicted in around 100AD that the world population could double in the following century and the world`s resources wouldn`t sustain such a number. It`s now 100 times greater and that`s what is causing pollution to gain ground over natural degradation.
Cars are just a soft target, we need euthanasia for everyone 1 year older than me and that will solve the problem and avoid the pension time-bomb associated with human longevity.
The electric Elan would be fascinating but why spoil a valuable car? Wouldn`t it be easier, cheaper and just better to use some kit car as a base. The constraints of the backbone chassis, in particular, seem an unnecessary difficulty.
Jim



:D That will give you one year to live and you will spend all that time burying all the billions euthanized; you cant' burn them. too much pollution.

8)

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 12:57 pm
by jimj
Bill, obviously, the euthanasia programme would, just like the road tax exemption, extend survival each year by a year. I wouldn`t suggest otherwise, that would be just too harsh. Burial would be carried out by fit, long term unemployed people who would otherwise, also, be euthanized after 5 years of unreasonably claiming benefits. A better idea; burning actually emits less CO2 than decomposition and the cremation could generate electricity for all these electric cars which would otherwise drain the national grid.
Jim

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 3:46 pm
by john.p.clegg
" we need euthanasia for everyone 1 year older than me"

Is that on a rolling basis? If so count me in!

John :wink:

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:26 pm
by billwill
jimj wrote: A better idea; burning actually emits less CO2 than decomposition


I find this unlikely, especially if you plant tree or bush seeds over the corpses. 8)

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:27 pm
by billwill
john.p.clegg wrote:" we need euthanasia for everyone 1 year older than me"

Is that on a rolling basis? If so count me in!

John :wink:



But you don't know how old Jim is !

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:50 pm
by john.p.clegg
Quote by jimj " I had four cosecutive Elans in the 60s/70s" , if we take that as 1969 and assume aged 18 that makes his D.O.B. 1951...a lot older than me....

John :wink:

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 12:09 am
by mct340
m carling wrote "How much range do you want?"

normal spirited driving - 60 miles

track day - three 20 minute sessions

auto x - 15 minutes of flat out flogging

Estimated cost for parts - roughly $25,000.00 Cad.

1- Curtis 1238-7601 HPEVS Dual AC-35 brushless motor -96 Volt ($9,720.00)

32- SinoPoly Ion Phosphate 100ah batteries ($140.00 each)

250 Lb Ft torque from 0 rpm to 3000 drops to 75 Lb Ft by 5250 ( will need a GEAR Vendor - $3,000.00)

max draw 1320a DC @3200 rpm - 900a DC @ 5000

Motor weight - 68kg - Batteries are 3.13kg each - Gear Vendor 25kgs

Total weight of conversion roughly 220 kg.

weight of twincam motor, tranny, clutch and gas tank - Anyone?

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 12:52 am
by mcarling
mct340 wrote:m carling wrote "How much range do you want?"

normal spirited driving - 60 miles

track day - three 20 minute sessions

auto x - 15 minutes of flat out flogging

Estimated cost for parts - roughly $25,000.00 Cad.

1- Curtis 1238-7601 HPEVS Dual AC-35 brushless motor -96 Volt ($9,720.00)

32- SinoPoly Ion Phosphate 100ah batteries ($140.00 each)

250 Lb Ft torque from 0 rpm to 3000 drops to 75 Lb Ft by 5250 ( will need a GEAR Vendor - $3,000.00)

max draw 1320a DC @3200 rpm - 900a DC @ 5000

Motor weight - 68kg - Batteries are 3.13kg each - Gear Vendor 25kgs

Total weight of conversion roughly 220 kg.

weight of twincam motor, tranny, clutch and gas tank - Anyone?

1. A 10KWh battery pack is not going to give you even half the range you want.
2. Drawing 1320 amps from a series (not paralleled) bank of 100AH cells is a discharge rate of 13.2C i.e. fully charged to fully discharged in 4.5 minutes. Discharge rates of more than a few C are very harmful to the lifespan of the cells.
3. My understanding is that the stock engine plus transmission, including starter motor, dynamo, etc. is just over 200kg.

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 1:38 am
by lotustastic
mct340 wrote:I've "pulled the plug" on this for now. I agree with you on your cost estimate. That would be ok if I could be sure about battery life. Rumour has it if you lean on the gas pedal your range goes way down. Thoughts?


Yes, flooring it affects range greatly. As owner and daily user of a Nissan Leaf (all electric) in U.S for 3 years (45000 miles) my best is 5.8 miles per kWh and that's driving in Eco mode very conservatively in moderate climate and using every downhill to my advantage for regenerative braking. It has a 24 kWh battery. Average driving is around 4.5 miles per kWh. Electric cars are exciting especially when you floor it as they are lightning quick and surprise many bystanders as even the family style Leaf can take many Mustangs and Bimmers off the line up until about 30mph. It accelerates in normal drive mode to 35mph in about 2.5-3 seconds. The battery placement at low center of gravity makes it a great handler as well. Electrics are fun but as a track car, I don't see the range being there as the concept there is to drive fast and that uses lots of power as compared to normal driving for errands. I fear one would have to pull into the pits long before the session ended. For comparison, I believe the Leaf weighs about 3300 lbs.

David D.

Re: Electric Elan

PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 12:38 pm
by gjz30075
It's about the engineering exercise. Just look at Steve Broad's Cosworth project. Justification? Who cares.
I say go for it.


Greg Z